One of the main objectives of Victoria’s
Mental Health Act 2014 is to enable and support persons with
severe mental health problems ‘to make, or participate in, decisions about their assessment,
treatment and recovery’ (section 10(d)). An important guiding principle is that those ‘receiving mental health services should be involved in all decisions about their assessment, treatment and recovery and be supported to make, or participate in, those decisions, and their views and preferences should be respected’ (section 11(1)(c)). Making and participating in decisions about assessment, treatment and recovery may be aided through the use of
advance statements (Division 3) and
nominated persons (Division 4).
In practice, these recent changes to the Mental Health Act mean people who received various psychiatric diagnoses now have the right to be more involved in decisions relating to their treatment and care. This Talking Point is about people’s experiences of when and how they had been or not been involved in treatment decisions, including times when they found it difficult to make decisions for themselves.
Quick Links
The right kind of support
Good and bad decision making practices
Indirect support
Practical challenges to support
Having a good relationship with a psychiatrist, or other mental health practitioner was seen as very important to the people we spoke to. Continuity of care, in the sense of having a practitioner who was familiar with a person’s life story and who was prepared to take action when appropriate, was also important. You can read more about positive and negative experiences people had with mental health practitioners and GPs here: Experiences with mental health practitioners: Psychiatrists, counsellors and others, Experiences with GPs. Many people had suggestions about how mental health practitioners could improve the services they offered through a more person-centred approach and you can read more about that here: Advice to others: Health, mental health, and allied health practitioners.
Gurvinder contrasted his experience with a psychologist and psychiatrist while he was in hospital. Having the chance to explain exactly how his voices were affecting him was critical to good care.
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Can you remember anybody who listened to you?
Yeah there was one person. There was a psychologist [um]. His name was [psychologist’s name] and he was a really good psychologist. Like he would listen to me and he’d go, “How are you feeling now? You getting any symptom?” And he gave me techniques to deal with the voices and stuff like that, which I found really helpful and with thoughts that would come into my mind. I found his techniques very, very helpful.
Like he taught me oh, what do you call it? Mindfulness and taught me about techniques to put, you know if you have a thought, put it on a leaf and let it just go down the stream, close your eyes and all sorts of you know, just little things to take away the voices or thoughts or negative feelings I was having.
And I found that useful and he would come and see me every couple of days and check in with me, “How you going? You know, do you have anything you want to talk to me about?” And stuff like that. So he was pretty good.
But other than that, the psychiatrist you would see you know, once every few days or whatever and she would ask about the symptoms you were experiencing but not getting into a lot of detail about it and stuff. Yeah. Whereas with him I could get into detail with it. Yeah.
Do you think it would have been helpful if people got into the detail?
I think it would be.
In what way?
It would give, give them more of a chance to know exactly what’s going on. Like exactly how you’re feeling and what the actual symptoms are. Like they’ll know what the symptoms are, but like how they’re affecting you. How the symptoms are affecting you. Like with me, the symptoms would make me insomnia. Like I wouldn’t get sleep til like 3:00 in the morning, 4:00 in the morning because of the symptoms, like, the voices and stuff.
Whereas yeah, and I never got to like tell my psychiatrist that or whatever and he went into detail and said, “Oh okay and what do you do about it?” And he goes, “No you should do this”. Like he actually gave you advice on how to manage it and deal with it. Whereas the psychiatrist would just hear you out and not really do much about the situation besides maybe looking at your medication or something or putting on a PRN for a sleeping tablet or whatever, you know.
The people we spoke to talked about the direct and indirect support they received, or felt was missing, when decisions were made about their treatment. Because people often experienced ups and downs in living with severe mental health problems, treatments often needed to be adjusted or changed and regularly monitored. Mostly it was mental health practitioners who made treatment decisions, and so feeling ‘supported’ in that context often meant participating in or feeling a valued part of that process.
Participation or ‘collaboration’ in decision-making around treatment decisions was something that many people felt very strongly about. However, this did not always mean having a direct input into or being subject to treatment decisions they fully agreed with at the time. For many people we spoke to, participation could simply mean feeling cared for and having their particular circumstances taken into account, or being given a treatment that they felt worked for them. Some people were very unwell when treatment decisions were made. As Chris said: ‘Rational thoughts were very hard’. Carlo described how he ‘wasn’t really able to express [himself] that much’. Some people said they were pleased that someone else had made the decision for them (see also Community Treatment Orders).
The right kind of support
The type of support that people felt they needed tended to vary according to what was going on for them at the time. As Brendan said, getting ‘the right kind of support’ was important as ‘that’s the only way that you can get there’. The kind of support people wanted varied. Some wanted to be involved in all treatment decisions and to have the freedom to change their medication dosage or stop it altogether (see Medication: Choice and non-compliance). Others wanted more support in the form of oversight of their treatment and care: someone who was keeping an eye on the various aspects of their care. Brendan said that it was important to have a follow-up after each appointment, because when he had to wait four months for an appointment with a psychiatrist, he felt he had fallen ‘through the cracks’.
Brendan didn’t feel he was well-managed. He tried to get admitted to hospital on several occasions and was turned away each time.
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Did they give you a reason as to why they couldn’t admit you?
I think they might’ve, but I don’t recall what it was. I don’t think it was anything that I felt was valid, at the time. It wasn’t the first time.
Later on I tried to get admitted as well and I was told because I was smiling that I obviously wasn’t depressed. So I said, “Oh okay”. So yeah, like, I guess by this stage, and especially after what had happened, when the first time I was admitted and sort of just being shown the door, you know, being given a business card, I guess I’d really lost a lot of faith in the system and that I think by this stage I was starting to realise that it was really just up to me to try and get the help that I needed, that nobody was going to give me any support.
There was no real sense that I ever was managed, and I guess after not getting admitted that time, and driving back with my brother I was told to go back. I think I spoke with my psychiatrist again, he said, ‘Look, go back, I’ll ring up’, because he knew people who worked at the psych ward there.
Although some people wanted control over their treatment from the start, others wanted different kinds of support depending on their particular needs at the time. When people were first unwell, some said they needed more support from their family and friends while others looked to mental health professionals to help and guide them. Many people described how they had felt overwhelmed as a consequence of navigating their diagnosis, dealing with unfamiliar terminology, and finding what sources of support were available.
Ann explained that by the time she got to hospital she was too unwell to ‘advocate effectively’ for herself.
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In relation to treatment, I don’t feel like I really had much of a say but by the same token I think when I was first admitted on each occasion I wasn’t in a position where I could have advocated effectively for myself. I don’t enjoy going to hospital, so it’s sort of crisis-driven for me which I’m sure it is for most people.
So by the time I’m there I don’t really have the strength or the cognitive ability to advocate effectively for myself. So lots of the decisions were made by the treating team like the psychiatrist and the nurses, and they were probably made in conjunction with my ex-husband who I was obviously still married to at the time. Things around medication was always led by my psychiatrist, but when it came to ECT that was consented for by my ex-husband. So yeah, I don’t feel like I had much of a say at all, but I don’t think I was in the position where I could have had much of a say.
People’s expectations of how much and what kind of input they should have could change over time. As they grew to know what worked for them and what didn’t, or found ways to manage their symptoms, some wanted more control over decision making. If they had a doctor who had been with them for a long time and with whom they had a good relationship, this could work well. Allen and Charlie said they self-managed their medication (stopping taking medication or changing the timing of medication) with their doctors’ permission. But sometimes people were not given that freedom. Susana said she felt like she was having her ‘word doubted’ when a doctor did not trust her to take her medication in tablet form and insisted on an injection. Despite feeling as though she was recovering at that point, Susana said this decision by her doctor took ‘control out of [her] life’.
Many people described how once they felt ‘recovered’ they became involved in voluntary work in mental health organisations, which gave them the opportunity to use their experience and expertise for peer support. Chris, who worked as a volunteer in a mental health organisation, defined ‘good care’ as a person being ‘able to decide what treatment they have, the treatment process, who is involved in the treatment, where the treatment takes place’, and whether or not there should be any follow-up.
Good and bad decision making practices
Feeling supported could mean anything from having a say in treatment decisions to being advised about a diagnosis or particular treatment at an appropriate time and place. Having the opportunity to share personal experiences and difficulties, and feeling listened to was another form of support that was appreciated by the people we spoke to. For some, having a good relationship with mental health practitioners and being able to speak frankly was more important than reaching a particular decision. People described being willing to accept a medical decision if they felt that their concerns were taken into account. Those concerns may have been about actual or perceived side effects of medication, about whether the medication was working, or how it affected their lives (for example by making them sleep too much, increasing hunger and weight gain, or reducing concentration). But if these concerns were ignored or treated as unavoidable, this could lead to non-compliance or cause resentment.
Helen was given diazepam for her stress and anxiety but it didn’t suit her busy family life.
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So I went to the doctor’s and I told him everything and he goes, “Oh, you’re going under a bit of stress. You’ve got anxiety”. He put me on VALIUM (diazepam) in those days, but I was supposed to rest. But when you’ve got a family, you know, you don’t have time to rest. And as I said, you know, we went shopping one day and it just got the better of me and I just flaked out in bed and that’s when my husband threw the tablets away, you know.
Where people felt very knowledgeable about their own mental health, and about service and treatment options, it could be upsetting not to be given some control over the decision making process. The fear of not having control could be difficult to overcome where there was no central contact for decision making or where the main decision maker was someone with whom the person did not have a good relationship. Some people spoke of a ‘power imbalance’ between them and mental health practitioners or other mental health staff, or about feeling pre-judged and not treated as an equal.
Carlo described a good balance with his psychiatrist who was ‘kind of monitoring’ him.
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The medication talk, does that come up because he brings it up? And he just checks in with you about how you’re going and whether you need it. Is that the context…
Yeah, my psychiatrist brings it up and his, I guess based, on my perception, based on his clinical experience that it’s a real risk factor for me.
So he’s quite concerned, but he’s trusting you and…
Yeah, it’s kind of monitoring, letting me monitor knowing that I am doing all the right things to maintain my balance in my life and my mental health, yeah. Yeah, it’s huge, yeah, and I will say…
I guess that’s important in terms of the rapport you have with him?
Absolutely, yeah. It’s important and the trust that he’s given me to manage that and, and I’ve also expressed that you know my life is game on now, it’s not game over. So I don’t want to risk, I don’t want to put myself in that risk again or experience that again. So if I ever, if I really needed to I would take medication again, yeah.
Treatment decisions in hospital could feel like something that people had no control over. A few people described these decisions as being made by others rather than decided jointly. When Brendan was in hospital he said ‘they started to put me on medication’ but when he was back home and seeing a psychiatrist things seemed more collaborative: ‘we tried a couple of different medications’. In contrast, while Maria was in hospital she had a good case manager who took a ‘holistic approach’ and would see her but would also meet with her psychiatrist to ‘swap notes’.
Anna didn’t feel there was any supported decision making in hospital. In contrast, she described her relationship with her current psychiatrist as a ‘partnership’.
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And the whole experience whether I’ve been in public or private has been one of being told what I need to be doing to get well, and what I will be taking and what treatment I will be doing. And quite often if I’ve gone in as a voluntary patient, they make me involuntary because I don’t agree to their treatment. And of course being an involuntary patient, they can do what they like with me. So in terms of supported decision making, there has been absolutely none in the hospital system.
That however I can thankfully say has changed just in the last two months, where I have managed to get a really fantastic psychiatrist and she’s very eager to have my input. She says it’s a partnership. And it’s a really big thing because it really gives my dignity back and respect to me as a person.
And for the previous seven years, to be treated almost like a dog in a pound is something that I just have really, really struggled with. And it’s been to the point where I’m really, really actually scared to go into hospital, even though I recognise myself that it’s something that I need to do because I know that my life’s in danger, I feel totally unsafe. I put my children in really difficult positions because they can see me at my lowest, and attempting to self-harm and all of that, which is I know really detrimental to them. But when I get into that space I don’t think rationally anymore.
Most people recognised that decision making wasn’t an exact science and that it often meant trying out different things. Susana said she was forced to go to hospital after she refused treatment. She didn’t think it could have happened any other way because although the medication she refused wasn’t right for her, she said the doctors wouldn’t have known that: ‘it was just kind of like a process… kind of developing over time, seeing what’s the best’.
Indirect support
While some people felt they had not been given the opportunity for input into treatment decisions relating to their care by medical professionals, quite a few did speak about support they had received from elsewhere, such as family, social workers or peer support. Mental health organisations and support forums were also sources of help and information (see also Mental Health Community Support Services and Peer Support). Luana described how a staff member from a mental health organisation helped her to prepare to speak to the psychiatrist about coming off her Community Treatment Order. Ann heard about the possibility of drawing up an Advance Statement when she met someone at a support forum.
Some people had families who were very involved in their care and treatment decisions, but others said they did not have any supports (see Family and friends). Family could be important in following up on treatment decisions. As Brendan said, ‘Mum rang me up afterwards and she said to me, “Oh, you know, how’d it go?”‘. Gurvinder described how his parents had always been very involved in his treatment decisions and played a big part in his life.
Helen wished her family had been more direct in making her see a doctor sooner.
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You need somebody to give you a kick up the pants sometimes and say. Like, especially when I wasn’t going to the doctor’s, you know, over the last three years. They kept on saying, “You’ve got to go to the doctor’s, Mum. You’ve got to go”. And I’d say, “Yeah, yeah, I will, I will”. But I never went. From that angle, they should have come up here one day and say, “Go and have a shower, get dressed, we’re going to the doctor’s”. And I would have gone.
But, you know, I needed somebody to really push me to do that, you know. Not just say it. They should have… I don’t want them to feel guilty about the last three years, but I feel if one of them had come and said, “Listen, we’ve rang up your doctor, made an appointment, get dressed, we’re going”.
And, you know, I would have started my recovery much sooner. I would have got back on my meds. I would have had the help that I really needed. But no use crying over spilt milk. It’s happened. I look at it as an experience, as a part of a chapter of my life that I had to experience to get to where I am today.
Practical challenges to support
Quite a few people spoke about long waiting times to see psychiatrists and psychologists and long gaps between appointments because mental health professionals were very busy. Brendan went to see his GP after he was turned away from hospital. He said his GP gave him the number for a psychiatrist but by the time he got an appointment he had been out of hospital and unsupported for four months. Brendan said getting the right support was ‘pot luck’. Others complained of psychiatrists taking little time, such as Carlo who felt that psychiatrists ‘rush, rush, rush’. Others recalled feeling as though psychiatrists had no real interest in them as a person during their sessions.
Simon had one psychiatrist who didn’t care enough to ‘dispute’ things with him.
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It’s interesting you mention the idea of equality in that space, could l you talk to why that’s important, as somebody who…
Because with a mental illness, we go through so much discrimination and inequality. And doctors have put themselves up on such a high pedestal, and they impose their structures on us, from the outside. And they don’t know or care what we are going through. They don’t listen to us. Most of them don’t listen to us. We would probably see a psychiatrist for about 15 minutes once every three months. And the treating clinicians, well you can get good ones or you can get bad ones.
But I’ve had two at [regional town]. I’ve had one really crappy one and one really excellent one. Fortunately the crappy one’s gone up and is now doing admin, so they’re not dealing with patients anymore.
And could you talk through what made that one so crappy?
She couldn’t be bothered listening to what I said, she didn’t want to listen, she didn’t want to engage in an appointment with me. It was basically just sitting there, “Oh yeah, how’re you going, okay”. It was just all surface level stuff, there was no emotion in it. You have to have emotion, you have to care about someone and if you don’t care about them enough to dispute something with them. Then you’re not doing your job.
Could you talk about…
There are times when you will need to dispute something with someone, if they’re being unrealistic. If they’re being irrational, you have to be able to say, “Look, I don’t think that’s true. Or maybe you’re just imagining things”. But not to sit there and say, “Yes, everything’s fine, okay I’ll see you next week”. No emotion in it.
When people were unwell, talking openly to a psychiatrist about their mental health could be frightening and people often reported they found it impossible at first. The ultimate power of the psychiatrist and uncertainty about what could happen made it difficult to establish trust. Carlo was afraid to say how he really felt. When a psychologist he was seeing asked him if he was suicidal, he said he didn’t reveal how bad he felt because he ‘didn’t trust anyone by that stage’ and was ‘quite fearful’.
Charlie said in the 1990s it was hard to ask to change medication. But she knows the system better now and finds mental health staff more approachable.
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So for that period of time, for example, if you were receiving those side effects, was there ever a space where you could go and say I’ve got to get off these meds that…
Oh I wouldn’t have even asked.
Could you talk about why?
I’m going back to the ’90s, mid ’90s when – why didn’t I ask? Because it was just I was not the only one. Common complaint between, you know, friends. It’s not something you would approach in those days, approach a staff member about or you could just say it and they’re just like side effect, yep.
And do you think it’s different now?
I’m a bit smarter now. It’s taken me till I’m 50 but I’m a bit smarter now. I know, you know, if I haven’t learned anything about the system in 30 years and I have, yeah well, in terms of looking after myself I know who to approach and why, and yeah. The system now is totally different, yeah, they’re very approachable, mental health workers.
Being given medication without proper consultation could be very damaging. When a medication change was prescribed but had not been discussed, some people refused to take it. When Michelle was given medication in hospital, she described holding it under her tongue. Once the nurse had gone, she would decide whether to take it, split it in half or throw it down the sink. She said she once refused a medication given by the dispensary because it wasn’t her usual medication – it had been changed overnight but no one had told her: ‘it just had been done without my collaboration, my knowledge’. When medication decisions were forced on people this could undermine their self-esteem. Bernadette was given injections against her will and says this took away any opportunity for her to choose.
David felt he should have had some input into the decisions around his medication. Although it stopped him hurting himself, the side effects were bad and he came to resent his psychiatrist.
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Could you give an example, do you think, of one that’s been a negative experience around decision making and one that’s been a positive one?
Certainly, I mean I guess initially the choices of medications when I went on, when I started to have the serotonin syndrome symptoms and was changed over to EFFEXOR (venlafaxine) and EPILIM (sodium valproate) and SEROQUEL (quetiapine), I didn’t feel I’d had really an input into that. That’s not my memory of it anyway. I don’t recall being involved in – being part of the decision making process.
And so there was a bit of resentment over being, you know, told to take these things that were having such a large impact on me. And I felt like, you know, they might have been stopping me from hurting myself but at the same time, they weren’t helping me really in terms of leading a life and I was totally at the mercy of the side effects really. So I built a bit of resentment up and that’s probably what led me to stop seeing my psych. Because I, yeah, I felt like I wasn’t really involved in that choice.